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Keyer Farnsworth/Weight Problem
W8OI
#1 Posted : Sunday, August 12, 2012 8:21:56 AM(UTC)
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The LOGic keyer farnsworth and weight are wildly wrong on my computer (Windows 7). I cannot make characters sound right. Any word on the when we'll get the next update? I want to see if it solves this problem or if I have to go back to LOgic 8.
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W7OO
#2 Posted : Sunday, August 12, 2012 8:39:27 PM(UTC)
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For what this is worth.....

I am running Logic 9 and Windows 7. I only operate CW. My Farnsworth is working just fine. I am not at my logging computer right now but I think I have it set at 3%. That works out to just a little more space between characters. I'm sure Dennis can provide better information but I thought I'd get a quick reply in here.

Good luck with it.

Bill
WN4AZY
#3 Posted : Sunday, August 12, 2012 9:44:49 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: W8OI Go to Quoted Post
The LOgic keyer farnsworth and weight are wildly wrong on my computer (Windows 7). I cannot make characters sound right. Any word on the when we'll get the next update? I want to see if it solves this problem or if I have to go back to LOgic 8.

Ok, I wasn't aware that there was anything wrong with Farnsworth or Weight.

It does work differently than LOGic 9 -- it now works as described in the WinKey documentation and elsewhere. LOGic 8 was doing it wrong apparently. As I recall, changing weight or farnsworth affected overall speed in LOGic 8, and it should not.

Anyway, please describe the problem. First of all, does 0 weight 0 farnsworth work?

Tnx & 73,

Dennis WN4AZY
W8OI
#4 Posted : Monday, August 13, 2012 9:31:04 AM(UTC)
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Dennis, we discussed this on the phone a few weeks ago. I may have mis-charaterized the problem in my post. When using 0 farnsworth & 0 weighting my dahs are far too short, pretty much sound like my dits. My sending is not intelligible unless I do -50 weighting and even then it sounds like a very bad "fist." You heard this on the phone. This is on my brand new Windowns 7 "shack" computer. An old XP computer elsewhere in our house sounds fine with LOGic 9. And my shack computer sounds fine with old LOGic 8. When we talked you said to wait for the new LOGic 9 update and see if that solved the problem. I want to use LOGic 9 in my shack on my radios. So I was wondering when will the LOGic 9 update be ready. Thanks.
WN4AZY
#5 Posted : Tuesday, August 14, 2012 8:18:44 AM(UTC)
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Sorry, I do not remember our conversation at all. How did we leave it? Was I of the opinion that it was LOGic, or your computer?

That said, I DID fix a problem with LOGic that was hardware-related in the .44 update, but that was for someone else. The CW keyer relies on a hardware timer whose frequency varies from one machine to the next. His had a particularly fast timer, and I used a 32-bit integer when I should have used 64. The CW was super-super fast -- too fast to tell if the timing were off or not. I'll look up the dates of the DLLs that got updated and make sure they got installed (will post later).

Are you using a USB=>RS232 adapter that is not FTDI-based? Typically the prolific adapters WILL work for CW keying, but you never know.

Tnx & 73,

Dennis WN4AZY
W8OI
#6 Posted : Tuesday, August 14, 2012 9:36:39 AM(UTC)
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When we talked on the phone you were perplexed by the problem but said an update would be coming out soon and advised me to wait for it and see if that fixed the problem. I've been checking regularly for the update so wondered when it would be available.

I am using the W1GEE keyer device which I purchased from you and a USB to RS232 adapter made by DYNEX, model DX-UBDB9, which I think (but not sure) also came from you.

This works fine with LOGic 8 on this same computer, and it works on an old computer fine with LOGic 9. Unfortunately that old computer is a tower in our office. I use a new laptop in the shack and take it with me when doing portable operations.

Would you like me to call again and let you hear how this sounds over the phone?
W8OI
#7 Posted : Thursday, August 16, 2012 9:03:50 AM(UTC)
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Dennis, I just installed .44 to see if it helped. Ihad been using .43. It did not help.

Is there a way you could change the program so that I could decrease weighting even more? When I go as far minus on weighting as the program allows, -50, it gets close to sounding right. I think that if I could get to about -75, it would be okay. Any way to allow that much more negative weighting so that a computer like mine could compensate.

WN4AZY
#8 Posted : Thursday, August 16, 2012 11:01:33 PM(UTC)
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Offhand I don't see why the Weighting could not be changed as you suggested. I'll have to look at the code.

The Dynx adapter didn't come from us. No matter, look in the device manager at the device and look at the driver info. If it is FTDI you are be good to go. If not, like I say, keying has typically not been a problem with other drivers, but you never know. Do you have another COM port you can test with?

LOGic 9 uses different COM libraries than LOGic 8. 9 uses .net 2.0 technology. 8 used COMCTL32.OCX. It certainly sounds like a hardware issue.

Anyway, I'll look at the code and see if I see anything that would affect the dit/dash ratio.

Tnx & 73,

Dennis WN4AZY
W8OI
#9 Posted : Friday, August 17, 2012 7:35:27 AM(UTC)
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Dennis, the driver is a Prolific device. I do not see "FTDI" mentioned in device manager, just Prolific. I have used another port with the same exact results.
WN4AZY
#10 Posted : Monday, August 20, 2012 9:38:05 AM(UTC)
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Ok, is the other port Prolific too, or something else? Tell me a little about it.

Thanks,

DH
W8OI
#11 Posted : Monday, August 20, 2012 1:42:31 PM(UTC)
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Yes, Dennis, the other port is Prolific too.

All I did to change ports was move the Dynex USB-to-RS232 adapter from one USB on my laptop to another USB on that laptop. This adapter is connected to a W1GEE keyer which in turn is plugged into my rig's keyer jack. It made no difference. The dahs are not long enough.

Have you had a chance to look at the code to see if you could alter LOGic9 to allow for a wider range of weighting? When I go to LOGic 9's current negative limit of -50, the dahs get pretty close to being long enough to sound right. If I could go to maybe -75, I think it might sound okay.

Anyhow it sure looks like this is just effecting me, one computer, so I very much appreciate your diligence to solve this weird one.

Thanks,

Garry

W8OI
#12 Posted : Monday, August 20, 2012 2:42:06 PM(UTC)
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Oh, two more clues that might help you, Dennis.

1. I just noticed that in my situation the keyer does not track linerally. That is to say that the ratio of the dots to the dashes changes pretty dramatically with a change in speed. If I set it up to sound pretty good at 20 wpm, it will sound much worse at 40.

2. Also, the speed that reads on the screen is not close to actual speed. At a reading of 60 WPM, it is really sending 28 WPM. Showing 55 = 27 actual, 50=26, 45=25, 40=23, 35=21, 30=18, 25=16, 20=13, 15=11 etc. The slower the speed the nearer the screen speed is to actual.

Hopes this helps.

Thanks again.

Garry, W8OI
WN4AZY
#13 Posted : Friday, August 24, 2012 2:57:45 PM(UTC)
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If both are prolific, I would not expect a change if that is indeed the problem.

I changed it to allow the farnsworth to go to -75%. However, it is generally not wise to program around hardware problems. But check it out.

http://hosenose.com/Foru...c-9-Update.aspx#post1597
W8OI
#14 Posted : Friday, August 24, 2012 7:04:12 PM(UTC)
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Thanks, Dennis. I downloaded it and it made the keyer sound better at my favorite speed but it is still off when I change speeds. So are you saying I need to buy a FTDI-type USB-to-RS232 Adapter to fix the problem? I guess they are available at computer stores?

Garry, W8OI
WN4AZY
#15 Posted : Saturday, August 25, 2012 8:18:35 PM(UTC)
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Well, I don't KNOW that it is a Prolific problem. I have never run into this before. But I have seen Prolific do so many strange things I wouldn't be surprised.

We sell the FTDI-based adapters. They are difficult to find at most computer stores -- they typically don't say what chipset they use.

http://hosenose.com/stor...mp;PrimaryCatID=46&

Tell you what -- I'll go ahead and send you one. If it fixes the problem, fine. Buy it from me or send it back if you want to get it elsewhere. If it doesn't work, of course send it back. Either way your only risk is return shipping.

Let me know.

Tnx & 73,

Dennis WN4AZY

W8OI
#16 Posted : Sunday, August 26, 2012 1:42:29 PM(UTC)
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I sure can't beat that deal, Dennis. Yes, send it right away please because I cannot find one locally. I tried Bset Buy, Radio Shack and a local computer store before reading your post about sending one to me.

Got my fingers crossed that it will cure the problem.

Thanks.

Garry, W8OI
W8OI
#17 Posted : Saturday, September 1, 2012 10:42:59 AM(UTC)
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That fixed it, Dennis!

Got the FTDI adapter from you in today's mail, plugged it in, perfect CW! The trouble was indeed as you predicted. My new computer did not like the Prolific adapter but this FTDI one that you sent works beautifully.

Will get you the money right away.

Thanks so much.

Garry, W8OI
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